Had a great idea

[Silkie]

about a group of us buying a shared rig tension guage but then realised that my rigging is 4mm and everyone else has larger. Guess where the different models diverge?

(Silkie always seems to sail better on one tack than she does on t'other. Unfortunately neither my memory nor my log are good enough to remember whether it's the same one each year but I feel sure that rig tension must be implicated anyway.)

Might still be a good idea for you big girls?

[sahona]

Dave, do you have wind instruments?
I had to recalibrate mine to make the boat point higher on one side.
It was easier than messing with the rig...

[claymore]

Silkiepoos
If you talk to SaltyJohn he stocks them and I am sure that you can get one that does a variety of rig sizes

[So_Sage_of_Lorne]

I believe I have one in my garage, left over from a flirtation with fractional rigs.
You are welcome to borrow it if it can be found.
I will have a look later today.

Bob

Good heavens, went out to the garage and there it was.
Loose Model B 90 m for cables 5, 6 and 7mm.
Unless you are looking to set up to a specific KG load, my guess is that you could still use it to give even tension on your 4mm cable.

[Gardenshed]

Silkie,
No need for a rig tension guage, just invite all forumites to give your rig the once-over every time they pass your berth, leave a suitably sized spanner on your side deck with arrows indicating tighten/loosen. Suggest a prize to be donated to the person who can disprove the riggers saying that you can't overtighten a rig by hand.

More seriously, a guage is useful on a very serious one design race boats (Etchells, J109, dinghies etc) but overkill for the likes of us. You've seen my boat & that gets done by following the advice of a an old rigger friend of mine and others that I've raced with for many years. Quite happy to give you a hand next year if you want.

[Silkie]

Thanks for the offer GS, that would be much appreciated.

Thanks also to SSoL and I'll bear it in mind next year.

[Aja]

Silkie

You can download the Selden rigging manual from http://www.seldenmast.com/page.cfm?id=5564. Scroll down to 'Rigging Instruction' 'Hints and Advice'. On page 29 you will find the folding rule method. It is an excellent way to set up your rigging without gauges etc.

In fact the whole maunual is one worth keeping handy.

Regards
Donald

[claymore]

More seriously, a guage is useful on a very serious one design race boats (Etchells, J109, dinghies etc) but overkill for the likes of us.

Not making a big thing of this but I tend to disagree. Tuning does matter, I think the Silken one did mention going better on one tack than the other - well, a check on shroud tension should produce information that might explain this.

Cruisers who began their sailing life in dinghies tend to have their rig better tuned and the little things like topping lift let off etc and so the boat goes a bit better.
Of course it is all a matter of perspective, interest and each to their own.

There - that should render the post uncontroversial

[Silkie]

I think what Gardenshed was trying to say, in the nicest possible way, is that while rig tension gauges are doubtless very useful tools in the hands of those who know what they are doing, in my case it is much more likely that I don't even have the stick straight in the boat.

[Nick]

Silkie always seems to sail better on one tack than she does on t'other.

Is that mast support prop in the middle?

I find it is easy enough to get the rig tension equal by leaning on the shrouds and bouncing a little - or by detecting whether it feels more precarious having a midships pee on one side or the other.

We had a young guy on an Achilles 24 beside us in San Sebastian when we were there, making ready for an Atlantic circuit. He was busy tensioning his rig, so I begged a shot. We didn't even register on the gauge, and when I tightened it up as much as I felt comfortable with it still registered a puny amount. Now we have fitted the mast step reinforcement kit I have tightened the rigging a bit, but not a lot. My rule of thumb is it is OK when it looks very slightly slack hard on the wind just before you reef.

Although it is interesting to get the boat set up so you can point as high as possible - in ideal conditions in flat water - in practice if there is any sea running you don't usually want to sail that hard on the wind anyway.


All IMHO - your mileage may vary.


Aluffe - Achilles 24 - leaving La Gomera for the West Indies

[Gardenshed]

More seriously, a guage is useful on a very serious one design race boats (Etchells, J109, dinghies etc) but overkill for the likes of us.

Not making a big thing of this but I tend to disagree. Tuning does matter, I think the Silken one did mention going better on one tack than the other - well, a check on shroud tension should produce information that might explain this.

Cruisers who began their sailing life in dinghies tend to have their rig better tuned and the little things like topping lift let off etc and so the boat goes a bit better.
Of course it is all a matter of perspective, interest and each to their own.

There that should render the post uncontroversial

Not at all (contraversial) my good man.
I'm the first to agree that tuning is essential ans you have misread the point I was making (probably because it was badl made). Most of my sailing has been racing and getting the the rig set up right is a fundamental as is continual tweaking of all the sail controls.

The point I am making to Silkie is that buying and using a Loos guage isn't the answer.

A can of WD40 to lube the threads before any adjustments
The correct sized spanners (so that you don't round off the flats on the rigging terminals)
and some time on a windless afternoon with a downloaded Selden Manual is all the resource that you need.

The loos guage is for a more rarified level of tuning when e.g. in an etchells, you have a set of rig tensions and forestay lengths for different wind speed bands, but no matter what rig tension you have, you'll be altering backstay, mast chocks, kicker, outhaul, cunningham, jib sheet positions etc etc in a never ending cylce. Same for e.g J109's etc. but in all cases, the starting point is to centre the masthead in the middle of the boat, so that you don't have all the "right" settings but the rig hanging over one side of the boat.

We set up our rigs for the whole season, so the absolute tension as measured by a guage is of far less importance than getting it centred, symmetrical, no kinks/bends, some prebend to make sure it doesn't invert, well chocked at deck level (if keel stepped) and is a position that gives a wee bit of weather helm going up wind.
Tight enough so that the leeward shrounds aren't loose at the top end wind speed before reefing the main/rolling the genoa is a good guideline.

[Aja]

Middle 'C' on the caps sounds right to me....

Donald

[claymore]

Although it is interesting to get the boat set up so you can point as high as possible - in ideal conditions in flat water - in practice if there is any sea running you don't usually want to sail that hard on the wind anyway

Oh well - thats it then - no point in discussing this further as the Webrigmeister has spoken

Having the boat set up correctly is a good thing to do - having it set up for the prevailing conditions is surely taking that good practice just one vital step further?
Off for the weekend now so speak next week
byeeeee

[Nick]

Having the boat set up correctly is a good thing to do

Undoubtedly. But - for most of us it won't make that any difference so no point fretting beyone a certain point; for me that point is when you think you need a Loos gauge. Best to not put yourself or your rig under too much stress IMO. Your mileage may, as they say, vary.

Have a good weekend Claysie.

[So_Sage_of_Lorne]

My Loose gauge came with the HR29.

Being used to yachts with more stays than a Victorian schoolmarm, I was rather concerned at Mr Selden's suggestion that I should set the Caps at 25% of their breaking strain 1e 850kg and the lowers at 20% 640kg. It was much more tension than I would have applied without a gauge. She did sail exceptionally well though.

Now I am back to the "Tight to the eye loose to the hand" method more suited to my current fully stayed lady.