Questions from a new guy

JustThinking · Post by **JustThinking** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 2:08 am

Iâ€™ve been lurking for some time now and have gotten a lot of great info and enjoyment from the posts. Now Iâ€™m hoping you can fill in some blanks for a plan that Iâ€™m considering. Iâ€™ve done a lot of reading and searching and still have several unanswered questions.

Iâ€™m an American and have been kicking around several ideas on cruising in Europe. Iâ€™d like to spend a few years in Great Britain, France, and Italy. Because of the complexities in being a non-EU citizen Iâ€™m considering buying a boat in Great Britain with VAT paid so I at least donâ€™t have to worry about the boat being forced to leave after 18 months. Iâ€™ll handle the residency thing separately.

As it stands now, the plan is to get my Certificate of Competency(required?) and look for a boat. Currently considering a simple but solid, shallow-draft, ~28-foot sailboat in the Â£10,000 to Â£13,000 range. I think Iâ€™d like to spend a few months in England, then make my way slowly to the Med via the French canals.

Are there any special considerations I need to be concerned about as an American buying a boat in England? Iâ€™ve looked into buying a motorcycle over there and the regulations were daunting.

Concerning taxes, registrations, or other fees associated with buying and operating a boat, would there be complications caused by me being a foreigner?

Are there any benefits, or is it even possible, to change the boatâ€™s registration to the US? Or is it compulsory?

Would I need to buy insurance here in the US or over there?

My biggest problem is that I donâ€™t know how much I donâ€™t know. Thanks for any help.

Pete

claymore · Post by **claymore** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 6:38 am

Hi
There's a few questions in there and I can give you the answer to 2 at least.
You don't need a certificate of competence to sail in UK waters. Parts of the continent do require them but over here you can be just as incompetent as you wish - as most of us are!
The basic certificate involves a fairly straightforward assessment but depending on how much time and money you have or wish to commit - and what you have done already - there are better awards - such as the RYA Yachtmaster.
Going to the continent you'll need to be able to provide proof of ownership of the boat and VAT etc, which will be straightforward as you are considering buying a boat over here so will have that paperwork anyway.
Insurance - there are plenty of companies offering insurance. You gets what you pays for really and there are lots of debates about it - YBW.COM usually has one a month!
Your price range is fine and you'll pick something up for that money without a problem. There are people around here such as Shard and Silkie who don't really work so have lots of time to advise and guide.
Welcome to the forum

Post by **Silkie** » Thu Jul 06, 2006 10:08 pm

Welcome to the forum Pete.

I don't really have any relevant experience of the technicalities but feel I have to say something, having been so nicely introduced by Claymore.

It's probably not as regulated over here as you fear though joining the RYA might be useful since they have a legal department who would be able to give you sound advice rather than the kind you (sometimes) get on sailing forums!

JustThinking · Post by **JustThinking** » Thu Jul 06, 2006 11:08 pm

Thanks for the help. My biggest concern was getting knee deep into this plan and realizing that there was a major hurdle that I hadn't anticipated. I'm afraid I'm totally ignorant of your regulatory agencies etc.

I'll be doing some more research on the BW and I agree that joining the RYA would be a wise choice. My initial plan was to go ahead and get my certification of competancy over there, figuring that it would give me ample oppoutunity to find out all of the details.

In the States, the governing agency would be the Coast Guard for most issues and the Bureau of Land Management for inland waters. Any questions regarding operating a vessel would be answered by them.

I'm assuming that the BW plays the role of our BLM, What agency handles your coastal regulations?

Thanks again for the help,
pete

Post by **Silkie** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 12:23 am

The MCA is the regulatory body.

AFAIK (which isn't very far) there's nothing to stop you coming over, buying a boat and setting sail without any governmental involvement. Complications would only arise once you entered French (frexample) waters. AFAIK and IMO and this advice is only worth what you paid for it etc. etc.

Telo · Post by **Telo** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 10:41 am

claymore wrote:There are people around here such as Shard and Silkie who don't really work so have lots of time to advise and guide.
Welcome to the forum

You'll have gathered by now that Claymore's a cheeky git. Welcome to the forum.

Visiting UK boats to Europe are advised to carry an ICC and a UK SSR (Small Ships Registration). This should be possible if you are UK flagged - don't think there are nationality issues, but best to check with RYA (www.rya.org.uk) or CA (www.cruising.org.uk). VHF radio will need to be licensed (certainly until Oct this year), and you'll need a VHF operator's licence (though I suspect US equivalent will be fine if you hold one.

For Franch canals, you'll need ICC (endorsed for power, or for inland navigation?) and something called a CEVNI, which, ummmm, I know nothing about.

Superstrath · Post by **Superstrath** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 11:38 am

Claymore's got you two sussed, hasn't he?

Anyway, nothing to do with boats as such, but I'd advise a detailed correspondence with UK Immigration about your plans. I know nothing, but have an alarming tale. A friend of mine from Wisconsin, with a passion for Scotland, who had previously lived here for periods of up to a year, bought an apartment in Crieff so that she could live her Scottish Idyll dream whenever she could get over here. Last year, she took a long break from work, and flew over to stay for six months or so. Immigration grilled her at Glasgow, then grilled a mutual friend who was there to meet her. Seven days later they deported her. She is shattered, the apartment is sold, and I doubt if she'll be visiting the land of her forbears again.
I'm not sure, but I think a combination of a) Owning a propertry, and b) not having a job as such, added up to, "She's planning to stay here," in the eyes of the authorities. She actually planned to write a book - she is a published author, poet and journalist.

I'm only pointing this up because getting in and staying in for a long period may not be just as simple as we would all imagine it to be!

Sorry not to be more helpful. I'm sure the authorities will be happy to advise you. You could start here.

Alistair

Telo · Post by **Telo** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 11:53 am

Claymore's got you two sussed, hasn't he?

Not just us, he's just volunteered TCM to assist Avilion with his car/boat dislocation. Seems he's trying get some practice at being CEO of the "Claymore Crew and Useful Jobs Brokerage". Is there any end to this man's Napoleonic ambitions?

There can be few things worse than the genuinely lazy and relaxed being lectured at by chancers who who spend all day cruising the internet while picking up an enormous salary.

Harrumph!

claymore · Post by **claymore** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 12:53 pm

Chancers...CHANCERS!!
I'm a time served man I'll have you know.

Superstrath · Post by **Superstrath** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 12:56 pm

claymore wrote:Chancers...CHANCERS!!
I'm a time served man I'll have you know.

Aye, MacPhail, and we ken where ye served it!

Aja · Post by **Aja** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:26 pm

Shard wrote:
There can be few things worse than the genuinely lazy and relaxed being lectured at by chancers who who spend all day cruising the internet while picking up an enormous salary.
Harrumph!

Well by profession he admits to lecturing once in a while....

Donald

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