The militant wing of Flag Ettiquet!

[Windfinder]

A Classic from the Classic Boat letters:


I am writing in response to AJ Naishe (Letters, last month) concerning the
decision to fly the Welsh flag on my 1909 Bristol Channel pilot cutter Dolphin (Summer in
Svarlbard, CB 240).

Although I acknowledge the significant role that the Merchant Marine played in the Second World War, I do not wish to collude with Great Britain's currently aggressive role in international politics and therefore choose to fly the flag of my adopted homeland.

I understand that in the mid-20th century British national identity and its associated iconography were perceived as non-negotiable, a worthy tradition that reflected the contingencies of the time. However, in our post-colonial society where wealth, war and global migration problematise nation states' autonomy, such blind and unreflective loyalty seems merely to support corruption.

I commenced my tripnorth in 2004, a year after America and its lackey, our Labour government, ignored the UN position and invaded Iraq. Since that time,according to the UN figures, a million people have died in Iraq and 3m have been made refugees. In addition, tens of thousands of children died of disease between the first and second Iraq wars, as a result of the systemised destruction of purification plants and water treatment works by British and American intervention.

I feel ashamed of my government, and would argue that Mr Naishe's 'impeccable pedigree' is now besmirched. For this reason I forsake the 'butcher's apron' for the dragon of Wales.

During my trip I was questioned about my flag etiquette by both German immigration officials and the Swedish Police. On hearing my explanation for adopting the Red Dragon, they agreed, nodded and waved me on. I will continue to forgo the disgrace of the Red Ensign until the
'butchers' go.

I have have but two thoughts on this issue:

1) Isn't Wales also tainted? Don't Welsh Regiments Serve in Iraq? Isn't Wales part of the UK?

2) Have there been any convictions for showing the incorrect flag (or no flag) in the last ten years? Personally I couldn't give a toss what flag anyone wishes to Fly. (or non if they prefer) I hope the Policemen on the world have better things to do.

[DaveS]

I believe that every day you should learn something new, and from this contribution I take the new (to me) word "problematise".

On the substantive issue, I have considerable sympathy for anyone wishing to disassociate his or herself from illegal warmongering.

I myself fly (or, I suppose, "wear" to keep the pedants happy) the saltire but, when I get round to it, intend to talk to Mr. Flag about getting a proper Scottish ensign. This has led to the occasional incident, most memorable being a VHF conversation with a Norwegian (I think, it never was clarified) warship during a NATO exercise off Loch Ewe a couple of years ago. Amongst a number of daft and downright impertinent questions ("What cargo are you carrying?", "What is on your manifest?", etc.) was the following exchange:

"Are you flying an orange flag?"

"No, that's my danbuoy."

"What flag do you fly, sir?"

"The saltire."

"What is your nationality, sir?"

"Scots. What is your nationality?"

Lengthy pause. "Have a good day, sir. Warship Unintelligible out."

[Daveanmucker]

There is no such thing as a English Scottish or Welsh register of shipping we are ALL British ships. If you fly anything other than the red ensign when registered as a British ship then you will be considered silly and amateur by professional seamen. I was, and that's the way I see you along with all other proper seamen.

All this bullshit about warmongering ,or any other reason, is just a cop out an excuse for silly nationalism.

Who said 'that patriotism was the last resort of a scoundrel.'

[Olivepage]

"All this bullshit about warmongering ,or any other reason, is just a cop out an excuse for silly nationalism."

No - its not even that rational.

Simple attention seeking - all children do it in some shape or form. Often presents as exhibitionism in the adult.

Why else write letters about it?

[little boy blue]

... happened to the war of the roses chaps ?

[DaveS]

There is no such thing as a English Scottish or Welsh register of shipping we are ALL British ships. If you fly anything other than the red ensign when registered as a British ship then you will be considered silly and amateur by professional seamen.

I suppose if I didn't want to get into a flags argument I shouldn't have posted in the first place , however...

This contains a few assumptions and errors. In the first place my wee boat is not registered as a "British ship" on either Part 1 or SSR, nor AFAIK, confining myself to date to UK waters, has there ever been any requirement for it to be. In the second place, again while sailing in UK waters, there is no requirement AFAIK for me to fly anything at all. Thirdly, I'm sure the blue and white ensigned brigades will be overjoyed to be regarded by you as silly. Fourthly, I suspect that most professional seamen have a pretty poor opinion of the majority of yotties regardless of what colour of flag(s) they're displaying!

I may venture into RoI waters later this year, and if so I would intend to wear a red ensign and hoist a tricolour courtesy flag, thus fully complying with the rules in foreign waters. Incidentally, I'm working on the assumption that registration is not required for RoI: anyone know different?

[Daveanmucker]

I certainly do think that the Blue ensign brigade are silly, so no apologies for that. I also usually get ready to take defensive action when I see one coming towards me, they are usually useless annoying people.

[cpedw]

When I saw the title of this thread, I felt sure it must relate to the VHF transmission I heard in the vicinity of Oban on Friday evening. I would love to tell you all about it, but that would breach the terms of my licence and render me liable to prosecution. You wouldn't want that on your consciences would you?
It was extraordinarily amusing though.
Derek

[Windfinder]

You wouldn't want that on your consciences would you?

I could live with it! Tell us.

(Where does this nonsense about repeating stuff you hear on the VHF being illegal come form?)

[cpedw]

(Where does this nonsense about repeating stuff you hear on the VHF being illegal come form?)

It was in my SRC course and I think it's in the small print of the licence.

{Whisper} At about fiye to nine, on Ch 16 it went "All ships in the Oban Bay area, it is five minutes before something or other (I can't remember the term that was used) so prepare to strike your ensigns. And by the way it is an offence to wear a blue ensign without the appropriate club burgee, Yacht M.... take note (name removed to avoid sullying someone who may well be innocent). {/Whisper} That was it. Except there was a couple of seconds of ironic laughter soon after.
For a pompous git to make a transmission without identifying the transmitting station fair takes the biscuit.

[Olivepage]

"(Where does this nonsense about repeating stuff you hear on the VHF being illegal come form?)"

Its a throwback from the days when people made link calls on VHF.

I reckon its simply a case of an ignorant legal draughtsman who copied it into the new act without anyone asking what it was for or whether it was relevant. That coupled with the British obsession for secrecy.

Most certainly I've never heard of anyone ever being prosecuted for a breach.

So tell us the story and stop worrying

You know you want to!

Edit

Oh

You just did!

Well done

The summons is in the post.

[Fingal]

(Where does this nonsense about repeating stuff you hear on the VHF being illegal come form?)

It was in my SRC course and I think it's in the small print of the licence.

{Whisper} At about fiye to nine, on Ch 16 it went "All ships in the Oban Bay area, it is five minutes before something or other (I can't remember the term that was used) so prepare to strike your ensigns. And by the way it is an offence to wear a blue ensign without the appropriate club burgee, Yacht M.... take note (name removed to avoid sullying someone who may well be innocent). {/Whisper} That was it. Except there was a couple of seconds of ironic laughter soon after.
For a pompous git to make a transmission without identifying the transmitting station fair takes the biscuit.

It wasn't 'Marisca' was it? I do hope so!

[cpedw]

It wasn't 'Marisca' was it? I do hope so!

Sorry no. It was an anagram of Margo.
Derek

[Daveanmucker]

Bet they were flyin a Blue Ensign

[Fingal]

It wasn't 'Marisca' was it? I do hope so!

Sorry no. It was an anagram of Margo.
Derek

On reflection it could easily have been Marisca on the RT, he prides himself on a high standard of pomposity